Bari apologies but as you know I don't think Kenny has stopped the rot far from it. It all seemed to go wrong when Rafa came up with that mad rant about Ferguson and facts. Then he lost the plot and we have never recovered. Both Hodgson and the out of retirement Dalglish should never have been let within a million miles of the Liverpool job.

Ha, I know your feelings on Kenny. I was quite specific about my wording. He has stopped the rot. We haven't gone downhill worse since Roy's reign end and his began. If there was an overall chart on our progress, it was constantly going downhill from Rafa's final season until Kenny took over. He immediately brought us steeply uphill last season, and we've come back downhill this season from the standards which he opened up with with the beginning of his reign in January, but we still haven't sunk to the depths that Roy had us drowning in. We may not have progressed much under Kenny in your opinion, but we certainly aren't worse off than we were when he took over, would you not agree?

Its improved from the position Roy had us in yes but thats not saying much is it? A better comparison would be Rafa's time in the sense it was pretty much standard we qualified for the champions league its now a distant aspiration.

It may not be saying much, no, but he did stop the rot. Which my point, and my only point. That doesn't come with any proclamations of Kenny being the messiah and that he's brought us to a whole new level that I never knew existed, because it clearly isn't true. You have to see the difference without pigeon-holing people. There's too much 'dividing' going on here between fans.

Rafa did have us qualifying for the CL every season, yes, and I've always been a fan of Rafa (although I did agree that he had to go by the end of his reign) but it's a fair enough comment to point out that he didn't have a Sheik-driving Manchester City to compete with, nor did he have a strong Spurs team to deal with - infact, as soon as Spurs built a decent team, they finished ahead of us (in Rafa's final season). Aside from that, in his first season, Everton finished ahead of us to get 4th spot.